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Free documentary, <i>Kansas vs. Darwin</i>

Posted 27 February 2011 by Matt Young

According to NCSE, in honor of Darwin Day, 2011, the documentary movie Kansas vs. Darwin is available free on the web through March 14 -- that is, for the 30 days following Darwin's birthday. Thanks to Karen Spivey for the tip!

25 Comments

Mike Elzinga · 27 February 2011

I watched it; and it is excellent. The dissembling of the board members comes through loud and clear.

Shebardigan · 27 February 2011

Definitely worth the time. Some of the on-the-street candids were a bit painful, but informative.

veritas36 · 27 February 2011

Sharon Angle is pushing a new creationist movie. Being lauded in New Hampshire, apparently she's thinking of running for president...

http://www.concordmonitor.com/article/242461/angle-keeps-options-open?page=0,0

Glen Davidson · 27 February 2011

Don't expect anything very extraordinary from it. Mostly it's the same dreary stuff that we get from creationists.

There are some interesting figures even so. John Sanford, inventor of the "gene gun" shows up for the creationism side (see http://newtonsbinomium.blogspot.com/search?q=sanford for a critical review of his Mystery of the Genome). And there's plenty of "breathtaking inanity" on the stands.

Worth viewing and/or listening to, certainly, but you have to wade through a lot of boring creationist nonsense.

Glen Davidson

Jeff Neil · 27 February 2011

Why wouldn't honest science teachers want open debate on this subject. Isn't the core of a free society "free speach" and "free debate". What's the problem.
Are you afraid of the truth.

Are you even interested in the truth?

I think you are not.

mrg · 27 February 2011

Jeff Neil said: Why wouldn't honest science teachers want open debate on this subject. Isn't the core of a free society "free speach" and "free debate". What's the problem. Are you afraid of the truth.
No, we're afraid of the baloney. "Why wouldn't honest teachers want open debate on the flat Earth, government mind control projects, homeopathy, and 19th-century race science? Why shouldn't David Icke get equal time in our science classes?" What debate? If people don't want to buy evo science, they have a right, there's not much to say about it -- but if they're trying to claim that there's any fundamental dispute over it in the sciences, that is clearly false. Agree with them or not, it is just as obvious that the science reject creationism as it is that Mexicans don't speak French.

Stanton · 27 February 2011

Jeff Neil said: Why wouldn't honest science teachers want open debate on this subject. Isn't the core of a free society "free speach" and "free debate". What's the problem. Are you afraid of the truth. Are you even interested in the truth? I think you are not.
Creationism is not truth by any definition of that word. Creationism is not science, either, which is specifically why it is illegal to teach in a science classroom. Furthermore, why should students be forced to debate about topics that they have not yet learned?

Mike Elzinga · 27 February 2011

Jeff Neil said: Why wouldn't honest science teachers want open debate on this subject. Isn't the core of a free society "free speach" and "free debate". What's the problem. Are you afraid of the truth. Are you even interested in the truth? I think you are not.
You don’t know anything about the history of ID/creationism do you. Go over to the website of the National Center for Science Education and start reading all the court cases over there, especially Edwards v. Aguillard, McLean v. Kansas, and Kitzmiller v. Dover. Once you understand some history and science, come back and make your case again.

DS · 27 February 2011

Jeff Neil said: Why wouldn't honest science teachers want open debate on this subject. Isn't the core of a free society "free speach" and "free debate". What's the problem. Are you afraid of the truth. Are you even interested in the truth? I think you are not.
Why don't you give science lectures in your tax free church? Are you afraid of the truth? Why don't you give all the little sunday schoolers the evidence for evolution and let them decide for themselves. What's the problem? Are you afraid that once they see the evidence for evolution they will leave the church in droves?

J. Biggs · 27 February 2011

Jeff Neil said: Why wouldn't honest science teachers want open debate on this subject. Isn't the core of a free society "free speach" and "free debate". What's the problem. Are you afraid of the truth. Are you even interested in the truth? I think you are not.
All of the debate occurs in the scientific community, once there is a consensus about the evidence the debate moves to the minor details unless some new evidence comes to light. The stuff in K-12 science texts is pretty basic knowledge and not contravesial (except with fundies). Even as basic as this science is, it is difficult to grasp when first introduced even when presented in a straight forward way, and nearly impossible to grasp if intermixed with pseudoscience. But perhaps that's what you want.

Stanton · 27 February 2011

J. Biggs said:
Jeff Neil said: Why wouldn't honest science teachers want open debate on this subject. Isn't the core of a free society "free speach" and "free debate". What's the problem. Are you afraid of the truth. Are you even interested in the truth? I think you are not.
All of the debate occurs in the scientific community, once there is a consensus about the evidence the debate moves to the minor details unless some new evidence comes to light. The stuff in K-12 science texts is pretty basic knowledge and not contravesial (except with fundies). Even as basic as this science is, it is difficult to grasp when first introduced even when presented in a straight forward way, and nearly impossible to grasp if intermixed with pseudoscience. But perhaps that's what you want.
A slight correction: Science is totally impossible for a student to grasp if pseudoscience is deliberately intermixed with it.

Flint · 27 February 2011

As a shining example of censorship in science, I'm going to quote the opening paragraphs from the editorial in this week's Science News:

In the early days of Science News, editor Watson Davis compiled an extensive list of "stories that should be handled with care." By that he meant that they should be avoided altogether. Among the obvious prohibitions were stories about "telepathy and mind reading", claims of perpetual motion, and reports of sea serpents or "man-eating trees". Watson also issued warnings about divining rods, death rays and "messages from or to Mars or other planets." In the medical realm he cited claims of cures for cancer, baldness, obesity, and "cure of rabies by a stone or by shooting the dog."

So you see, the mainstream scientific publications have a priori decided to reject a lot of things without even any consideration of the merits (although Davis's fine print did allow for exceptions to all of these prohibitions, given valid scientific evidence).

FL · 27 February 2011

Why wouldn’t honest science teachers want open debate on this subject. Isn’t the core of a free society “free speach” and “free debate”. What’s the problem. Are you afraid of the truth. Are you even interested in the truth? I think you are not.

You are correct Jeff, and Kansas (2005-2006) is one of the places where your point was made abundantly clear. Fortunately, Texas and Louisiana succeeded where Kansas was unable to. In particular, the evolutionist tactics that previously worked in Kansas, such as boycotting state science-standards hearings and relying on media riducule, (for example late-night jokes from Leno and Letterman), were very noticeably absent during the Texas science-education reform process. And the director of the Louisiana ACLU publicly conceded that "if the (Louisiana Science Education Act is utilized as written, it should be fine..." Nevertheless, your point remains very easily proven (see the link below), and there remains a lot of work to do. Science education trumps Darwin indoctrination. Thanks for being willing to speak up. http://www.evolutionnews.org/2011/02/lobbyists_resort_to_myth-infor044241.html FL

Stanton · 27 February 2011

FL, how come you refuse to explain to us HOW Creationists have helped to improve the educational systems of Texas and Louisiana, even though through Creationists' direct meddling, they are among the very worst performing states in the entire continent?

Compared to other states, the students of Texas and Louisiana perform, at best, at a remedial level.

Stanton · 27 February 2011

BTW, FL, you still have not explained why Creationism and Intelligent Design deserve to be taught in a science classroom, even though they are nothing but pseudoscientific religious propaganda, in place of actual science.

Stanton · 27 February 2011

Then again, people like FL and Jeff Neil don't care about fairness, as their definition of "fairness" is to lie to, bully and otherwise force all other people to bow and scrape before their religious bigotries.

And people like FL and Jeff Neil don't care about truth, as they define "truth" as whatever underhanded or outrageous lie they can conjure to support their own religious bigotries.

Mike Elzinga · 27 February 2011

FL said: Science education trumps Darwin indoctrination. FL
The fact that you continue to make such statements - even though it has been demonstrated repeatedly here that you have no clue about what constitutes science - is another clear example of the kind of bullshit the scientific community is trying to keep out of the classroom. You also don’t know anything about the history of ID/creationism in this country. This is another one of your self-imposed blind spots. This medieval dungeon of yours is not a pretty place no matter how much it comforts you. There are entire universes of knowledge and expertise of which you are totally unaware. And you will not be allowed to throw stumbling blocks into the learning paths of other people’s kids. Your ugly profile is being held up to the entire world even now; and your nose will continue to be rubbed in it. You have no clue of just how bad you look.

Stanton · 27 February 2011

Mike Elzinga said: (FL has) no clue of just how bad (he) looks.
FL can not realize how idiotic or grotesquely deceitful he really is, what with those giant beams of wood lodged in his eyes.

Dale Husband · 27 February 2011

FL said: Science education trumps Darwin indoctrination. FL
Since there is no "Darwin indoctrination" (whatever that is) and since FL does not support any real science education, he must be delusional.

Wolfhound · 28 February 2011

FL said: Fortunately, Texas and Louisiana succeeded where Kansas was unable to.
Yes, truly those three states are great bastions of informed, enlightened citizenry where there is less poverty, fewer high school dropouts, and lower teen pregnancy rates. Oh, wait.

mike · 2 March 2011

Mike Elzinga said: I watched it; and it is excellent. The dissembling of the board members comes through loud and clear.
Help please. Don't see any obvious selection for free viewing, though the home page states it's available for free through the 12th (not the 14th). Only $60 and $5 options shown. Does registration not require a credit card number, or something?

mike · 2 March 2011

Oops. Sorry. Found it. Great big sun flower. Click here.

eric · 2 March 2011

FL said: In particular, the evolutionist tactics that previously worked in Kansas, such as boycotting state science-standards hearings and relying on media riducule, (for example late-night jokes from Leno and Letterman), were very noticeably absent during the Texas science-education reform process.
I doubt the Texas SBOE would've let Pedro Irigonegaray within 1,000 feet of their hearings. Too scared.
And the director of the Louisiana ACLU publicly conceded that "if the (Louisiana Science Education Act is utilized as written, it should be fine..."
Yes. Congratulations on passing a law with multiple possible applications, some of which are constitutional. That doesn't make the application you want to use it for constitutional. But please, keep using your time, money, and effort to pass ambiguous legislation while not actually teaching creationism in schools. I'm all for it when my opponents become so busy celebrating their safe arrival to the stadium that they forget to actually play the game.

fnxtr · 2 March 2011

O FFS.
Shorter Bill Harris: We're not saying teach Intelligent Design. But if we did, it wouldn't be religious.

fnxtr · 2 March 2011

(headshake)
JFC.
testifying != testimony.